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	<title>Comments on: Watch, Rewatch and Watch Again [Sky Crawlers and Darker than Black]</title>
	<atom:link href="http://higevsotaku.com/?feed=rss2&#038;p=313" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313</link>
	<description>Avid otaku resistance in the face of indisputable fanboyism. Love for fringe anime, assorted manga and numerous other Japanese diversions.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 30 Aug 2010 03:53:01 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: profH</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-13628</link>
		<dc:creator>profH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Aug 2010 10:16:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-13628</guid>
		<description>I happened to watch this show last night. Just my 2 cents - the cycle practically will never end since the &quot;teacher&quot; can also be revived, sad...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I happened to watch this show last night. Just my 2 cents &#8211; the cycle practically will never end since the &#8220;teacher&#8221; can also be revived, sad&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Hige</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2899</link>
		<dc:creator>Hige</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 20:37:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2899</guid>
		<description>@John: Hell of yes there was! It was the trippiest part of the film :(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@John: Hell of yes there was! It was the trippiest part of the film :(</p>
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		<title>By: John Mora</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2896</link>
		<dc:creator>John Mora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 20:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2896</guid>
		<description>THERE WAS A SCENE AFTER THE CREDITS? FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THERE WAS A SCENE AFTER THE CREDITS? FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF</p>
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		<title>By: Hige</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2362</link>
		<dc:creator>Hige</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Apr 2009 08:43:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2362</guid>
		<description>@gaguri &amp; @conniechiwa:
I think you&#039;re onto something. Perhaps the best way to find hope in the film is to watch Kusanagi&#039;s emotional progress. Her more welcoming nature towards the new Teacher clone suggest she&#039;s finally overcome the despair that plagued her throughout the film&#039;s run time. It also suggests that these clones aren&#039;t just carbon-copies, that they can offer unique and individual perspectives that differs from the last iteration, and that Kusanagi can learn from them. I think this is the kind of humanity I wanted to view the film in a more positive light. Time to watch it &lt;i&gt;again&lt;/i&gt; to see how it changes things.

Thanks for your comments, guys. It&#039;s been enlightening.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@gaguri &#038; @conniechiwa:<br />
I think you&#8217;re onto something. Perhaps the best way to find hope in the film is to watch Kusanagi&#8217;s emotional progress. Her more welcoming nature towards the new Teacher clone suggest she&#8217;s finally overcome the despair that plagued her throughout the film&#8217;s run time. It also suggests that these clones aren&#8217;t just carbon-copies, that they can offer unique and individual perspectives that differs from the last iteration, and that Kusanagi can learn from them. I think this is the kind of humanity I wanted to view the film in a more positive light. Time to watch it <i>again</i> to see how it changes things.</p>
<p>Thanks for your comments, guys. It&#8217;s been enlightening.</p>
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		<title>By: conniechiwa</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2359</link>
		<dc:creator>conniechiwa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 21:49:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2359</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s my interpretation of the story:

POINT OF VIEW
The story is told through Kannami&#039;s point of view but it really is all about the emotional hell that Kusanagi is going through.

BACKGROUND
&quot;Teacher&quot; (the ace pilot from Lautern), Kurita Jinrou (the lover killed by Suito Kusanagi, the base boss), Yuichi Kannami (the main protagonist who replaces Jinrou) and Hiiragi Isamu (the pilot that replaces Kannami right at the end of the movie) were all kildren clones created from the same personality template.

This is why Fuko (the courtesan who sleeps with Kannami at the beginning) makes reference that Kannami reminds her of Jinrou (who she used to have sex with). Most likely Fuko also used to have sex with Teacher (remember the scene where Kusanagi jealously confronts Teacher in Fuko&#039;s room).

KUSANAGI&#039;S DILEMMA
Teacher used to fly for Rostock but made a deal to join Lautern, on the condition that Lautern would genetically modify him into a normal &quot;adult male&quot; (Kusanagi mentions this in conversation with Kannami).

Here&#039;s the tragedy of it all: Kusanagi fell in love with Teacher and had a child with him, prior to Teacher switching over Lautern. Rostock than replaces Teacher with an exact clone of him named Jinrou. 

Thus, the tragedy that unfolds for Kusanagi -- she remains madly in love with Teacher but cannot have him. Unable to contain her feelings, she begins a relationship with Jinrou who reminds her exactly of Teacher (Remember the scene where Kusanagi hugs the bunk bed, which was likely the very same bed used by Teacher, Jinrou and Kannami). 

The plot seems to suggest that when Jinrou discovers that Kusanagi is actually in love with Teacher and not him (Jinrou just happens to look and talk exactly like Teacher), he is heartbroken and asks Kusanagi to kill him, which she does -- and this then sends her into the suicidal mood she is in for most of the movie, as she relives her heartbreak of loving but not having Teacher, and her guilt over killing Jinrou. 

Just when Kusanagi thinks things can&#039;t get any worse, along comes Kannami (another Teacher clone), who again triggers all her repressed feelings. The dilemma is that Kusanagi is unable to control her unrequited love for Teacher and continues to love him by proxy via Kannami. Finally, Kusanagi can no longer take the guilt and pressure and asks Kannami to &quot;kill me this time.&quot; But Kannami refuses and instead tells Kusanagi that in order to make things better, one must first choose to live.

When Kannami says &quot;I will kill my father&quot; at the end when he goes after Teacher, he has realised that he is nothing more than a clone of the Teacher template, and is trying to end the vicious cycle of heartbreak for Kusanagi&#039;s sake. Unfortunately, he fails.

At the end of the movie after the credits, Kannami&#039;s replacement arrives (yet another clone of Teacher). But something has changed inside Kusanagi, who seems to have taken onboard what Kannami said and has accepted her fate. Hence, she says &quot;I&#039;ve been expecting you.&quot;

QUESTIONS
The interesting thing is, how many clones of Teacher has Kusanagi killed? How long has this vicious cycle been going on? Was Jinrou the only one? Is Kusanagi a clone herself that has been killed before by a Teacher clone? The real tragedy would be a vicious cycle of Teacher and Kusanagi clones taking turns to kill each other to ease their pain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s my interpretation of the story:</p>
<p>POINT OF VIEW<br />
The story is told through Kannami&#8217;s point of view but it really is all about the emotional hell that Kusanagi is going through.</p>
<p>BACKGROUND<br />
&#8220;Teacher&#8221; (the ace pilot from Lautern), Kurita Jinrou (the lover killed by Suito Kusanagi, the base boss), Yuichi Kannami (the main protagonist who replaces Jinrou) and Hiiragi Isamu (the pilot that replaces Kannami right at the end of the movie) were all kildren clones created from the same personality template.</p>
<p>This is why Fuko (the courtesan who sleeps with Kannami at the beginning) makes reference that Kannami reminds her of Jinrou (who she used to have sex with). Most likely Fuko also used to have sex with Teacher (remember the scene where Kusanagi jealously confronts Teacher in Fuko&#8217;s room).</p>
<p>KUSANAGI&#8217;S DILEMMA<br />
Teacher used to fly for Rostock but made a deal to join Lautern, on the condition that Lautern would genetically modify him into a normal &#8220;adult male&#8221; (Kusanagi mentions this in conversation with Kannami).</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s the tragedy of it all: Kusanagi fell in love with Teacher and had a child with him, prior to Teacher switching over Lautern. Rostock than replaces Teacher with an exact clone of him named Jinrou. </p>
<p>Thus, the tragedy that unfolds for Kusanagi &#8212; she remains madly in love with Teacher but cannot have him. Unable to contain her feelings, she begins a relationship with Jinrou who reminds her exactly of Teacher (Remember the scene where Kusanagi hugs the bunk bed, which was likely the very same bed used by Teacher, Jinrou and Kannami). </p>
<p>The plot seems to suggest that when Jinrou discovers that Kusanagi is actually in love with Teacher and not him (Jinrou just happens to look and talk exactly like Teacher), he is heartbroken and asks Kusanagi to kill him, which she does &#8212; and this then sends her into the suicidal mood she is in for most of the movie, as she relives her heartbreak of loving but not having Teacher, and her guilt over killing Jinrou. </p>
<p>Just when Kusanagi thinks things can&#8217;t get any worse, along comes Kannami (another Teacher clone), who again triggers all her repressed feelings. The dilemma is that Kusanagi is unable to control her unrequited love for Teacher and continues to love him by proxy via Kannami. Finally, Kusanagi can no longer take the guilt and pressure and asks Kannami to &#8220;kill me this time.&#8221; But Kannami refuses and instead tells Kusanagi that in order to make things better, one must first choose to live.</p>
<p>When Kannami says &#8220;I will kill my father&#8221; at the end when he goes after Teacher, he has realised that he is nothing more than a clone of the Teacher template, and is trying to end the vicious cycle of heartbreak for Kusanagi&#8217;s sake. Unfortunately, he fails.</p>
<p>At the end of the movie after the credits, Kannami&#8217;s replacement arrives (yet another clone of Teacher). But something has changed inside Kusanagi, who seems to have taken onboard what Kannami said and has accepted her fate. Hence, she says &#8220;I&#8217;ve been expecting you.&#8221;</p>
<p>QUESTIONS<br />
The interesting thing is, how many clones of Teacher has Kusanagi killed? How long has this vicious cycle been going on? Was Jinrou the only one? Is Kusanagi a clone herself that has been killed before by a Teacher clone? The real tragedy would be a vicious cycle of Teacher and Kusanagi clones taking turns to kill each other to ease their pain.</p>
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		<title>By: gaguri</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2350</link>
		<dc:creator>gaguri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 23:15:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2350</guid>
		<description>*heavy spoiler comments ahead*

Hmm. For me the fact that everyone was expendable was shown earlier, like from that white guy folding his newspaper. And we know the kind of despair that drove Kusanagi and Jinrou to do what they did. And the kind of despair that is tormenting Mitsuya, and that nearly drove Kusanagi to let Kannami do the same thing to her. But even though his death was brutal, didn&#039;t Kannami find his own way of freeing himself from that endless cycle, soaring through the sky instead of crawling under the constant fear of Teacher? And although Kusanagi seems very sad to see that empty sky where no sign of Kannami is showing at the end, doesn&#039;t her smile after the credits say something more about her newly found way of living through this cycle? The slaughter scene may have been too bruta, but as long as we don&#039;t fall in despair and crawl away, challenging the Teacher for the chance of breaking the cycle, even if it&#039;s little, has meaning and who knows, perhaps Kusanagi can find in the next Kannami clone the strength and resolve to take down the Teacher.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*heavy spoiler comments ahead*</p>
<p>Hmm. For me the fact that everyone was expendable was shown earlier, like from that white guy folding his newspaper. And we know the kind of despair that drove Kusanagi and Jinrou to do what they did. And the kind of despair that is tormenting Mitsuya, and that nearly drove Kusanagi to let Kannami do the same thing to her. But even though his death was brutal, didn&#8217;t Kannami find his own way of freeing himself from that endless cycle, soaring through the sky instead of crawling under the constant fear of Teacher? And although Kusanagi seems very sad to see that empty sky where no sign of Kannami is showing at the end, doesn&#8217;t her smile after the credits say something more about her newly found way of living through this cycle? The slaughter scene may have been too bruta, but as long as we don&#8217;t fall in despair and crawl away, challenging the Teacher for the chance of breaking the cycle, even if it&#8217;s little, has meaning and who knows, perhaps Kusanagi can find in the next Kannami clone the strength and resolve to take down the Teacher.</p>
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		<title>By: Hige</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2348</link>
		<dc:creator>Hige</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 11:51:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2348</guid>
		<description>@gaguri &amp; @tai: I&#039;m surprised you guys saw hope in the ending of Sky Crawlers. Considering that the Teacher can&#039;t be defeated and that everyone involved with the war was expendable... it all just felt very bleak. No one had any true freedom, all of their humanity had been stripped down to what was applicable to the game they were trapped in. Maybe I&#039;m a pessimist, but watching the protagonist being brutally slaughtered by the Teacher soured any potential for hope for the surviving cast&#039;s future.

@Martin: I&#039;m relieved most anime doesn&#039;t use the two episode an arc method to be honest. It failed awfully when the series aired on the standard episode a week schedule (the pacing being worse hit) and it&#039;s much better when you can watch both back-to-back. Maybe it could work if both episodes were aired very close to another (two eps a week, perhaps) but having that seven day gap really sabotaged a lot of the nuance for me. 

@ETERNAL: Approaching it as an ambient of meditative experience seems like the best way to appreciate Sky Crawlers. I agree that&#039;s it&#039;s difficult when something is all atmosphere and no substance, but Sky Crawlers does have some meaning beneath its heavy stylisation. It&#039;s a lot like a book in that new meaning develops as you revisit and revisit. I&#039;d recommend giving it a second chance. :3</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@gaguri &#038; @tai: I&#8217;m surprised you guys saw hope in the ending of Sky Crawlers. Considering that the Teacher can&#8217;t be defeated and that everyone involved with the war was expendable&#8230; it all just felt very bleak. No one had any true freedom, all of their humanity had been stripped down to what was applicable to the game they were trapped in. Maybe I&#8217;m a pessimist, but watching the protagonist being brutally slaughtered by the Teacher soured any potential for hope for the surviving cast&#8217;s future.</p>
<p>@Martin: I&#8217;m relieved most anime doesn&#8217;t use the two episode an arc method to be honest. It failed awfully when the series aired on the standard episode a week schedule (the pacing being worse hit) and it&#8217;s much better when you can watch both back-to-back. Maybe it could work if both episodes were aired very close to another (two eps a week, perhaps) but having that seven day gap really sabotaged a lot of the nuance for me. </p>
<p>@ETERNAL: Approaching it as an ambient of meditative experience seems like the best way to appreciate Sky Crawlers. I agree that&#8217;s it&#8217;s difficult when something is all atmosphere and no substance, but Sky Crawlers does have some meaning beneath its heavy stylisation. It&#8217;s a lot like a book in that new meaning develops as you revisit and revisit. I&#8217;d recommend giving it a second chance. :3</p>
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		<title>By: ETERNAL</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2344</link>
		<dc:creator>ETERNAL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 22:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2344</guid>
		<description>I think I&#039;ll have to actually sit down and &lt;i&gt;study&lt;/i&gt; Sky Crawlers if I ever hope to get something out of it. I figured that it would be objectively good, on some level or another, but the subtle presentation lasted just a bit too long for my liking: just as we all hate it when the director/writer tosses information and plot twists at you 22 minutes a week, it also bothers me when a show comes off as &lt;i&gt;too&lt;/i&gt; atmospheric - the atmosphere lost its meaning to me by the end of the movie.

That said, I&#039;m sure I&#039;ll rewatch it some day; I&#039;ll just have to wait until I can figure out what it&#039;s about :P</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;ll have to actually sit down and <i>study</i> Sky Crawlers if I ever hope to get something out of it. I figured that it would be objectively good, on some level or another, but the subtle presentation lasted just a bit too long for my liking: just as we all hate it when the director/writer tosses information and plot twists at you 22 minutes a week, it also bothers me when a show comes off as <i>too</i> atmospheric &#8211; the atmosphere lost its meaning to me by the end of the movie.</p>
<p>That said, I&#8217;m sure I&#8217;ll rewatch it some day; I&#8217;ll just have to wait until I can figure out what it&#8217;s about :P</p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2340</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 18:46:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2340</guid>
		<description>Yeah, rewatching DtB is pretty rewarding at the moment. I have a better understanding the second time around, but how I&#039;ll feel about it when I get past the point where I put it on-hold last time will be interesting. The series structure works well for me - each story feels like an OAV but has a cliffhanger halfway through, and allows for a bit more room to develop the characters and storyline than a stand-alone episode structure like Mushishi or Kino&#039;s Journey. I haven&#039;t seen the &#039;two-episode arc&#039; idea used before or since though, which is surprising when I see how well it&#039;s being employed here.

The Sky Crawlers...man, I really want to watch this after hearing so many good things. Oshii movies always benefit from a second viewing in my experience - I can&#039;t devote my attention to the visual prettiness and thematic complexity simultaneously it seems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, rewatching DtB is pretty rewarding at the moment. I have a better understanding the second time around, but how I&#8217;ll feel about it when I get past the point where I put it on-hold last time will be interesting. The series structure works well for me &#8211; each story feels like an OAV but has a cliffhanger halfway through, and allows for a bit more room to develop the characters and storyline than a stand-alone episode structure like Mushishi or Kino&#8217;s Journey. I haven&#8217;t seen the &#8216;two-episode arc&#8217; idea used before or since though, which is surprising when I see how well it&#8217;s being employed here.</p>
<p>The Sky Crawlers&#8230;man, I really want to watch this after hearing so many good things. Oshii movies always benefit from a second viewing in my experience &#8211; I can&#8217;t devote my attention to the visual prettiness and thematic complexity simultaneously it seems.</p>
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		<title>By: tai</title>
		<link>http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313&#038;cpage=1#comment-2339</link>
		<dc:creator>tai</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Apr 2009 14:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://higevsotaku.com/?p=313#comment-2339</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t get myself to like Sky Crawlers. The plot may have been an interesting idea, but it&#039;s been done before (Brave New World/1984) and seemed to have been stretched for way too long by using extremely high-quality animation. I didn&#039;t like the main characters, either, they were all so quiet and seemed to do things for their own sake. When I saw the last scene I too believed there was hope, but even in that case the &quot;invincible&quot; Teacher will just be beaten by another who will rise to take the same position and continue the cycle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t get myself to like Sky Crawlers. The plot may have been an interesting idea, but it&#8217;s been done before (Brave New World/1984) and seemed to have been stretched for way too long by using extremely high-quality animation. I didn&#8217;t like the main characters, either, they were all so quiet and seemed to do things for their own sake. When I saw the last scene I too believed there was hope, but even in that case the &#8220;invincible&#8221; Teacher will just be beaten by another who will rise to take the same position and continue the cycle.</p>
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